Student Teachers - ACCIDENTLY DELETED THREAD

[Ds9jullian]

I erased my orginal message because I do not want to get in a heated argument about this because there are too many details.

Ashley

<font color="#051E50" size="1">[ March 24, 2005 05:45 PM: Message edited by: Ds9jullian ]</font>

[calyndra]

I am going to re-state a little bit of my deleted post, and I also want to say that it is not my aim to confront the beliefs of anyone, merely to state my own, so please don't take anything I say in a negative way. It's just my opinion and I have no desire to offend anyone.

I'm the other Kansas student teacher. My emphasis is instrumental music. I am currently student teaching 6-12th grade band. Music is, for all of you that aren't aware, an academic subject and is recognized as such by most boards, agencies, and organizations. It is not, however, a "core subject" worthy of state assessments and scrutiny by NCLB. Ashley is correct in saying that I, as a music teacher, have been labeled as "support staff" rather than faculty, along with drama, speech, art, home ec, p.e., and anything else that is not currently being tested by NCLB.

Regarding NCLB itself, I feel that it is a noble idea, a valiant effort. I also don't think it will work. I find the idea of testing every diverse type of child out there with one and only one method, the standardized assessment, to be unreasonable and the goals unrealistic. I simply do not think it is wise to set the students and teachers of the country up for failure, which is a mathematical certainty as we approach the 100% goal of 2013.

However, that isn't what this thread was originally about.

I am the one with the boyfriend who is also a teacher. I am the one who is concerned about not having the opprotunity to be a SAHM if I choose. I also love teaching and of course I knew in advance that I wouldn't be making a lot of money. In the situation I am now in, with current master teachers all around me telling me to "get out while I still can," I am more concerned about society than anything else. I think that in general, regarding education, that the priorities of society are a little (a lot?) screwed up at the moment. I am saddened, but resigned to the fact that there is nothing I can do to change this.

I don't feel that "unmotivated" is how I would describe myself in this situation. I am very motivated. I enjoy what I do. As I've said, I love teaching, and specifically I love teaching kids music. The teaching part is not what I am worried about. My fears are more about the fact that all these teachers are looking for a way out, not because they don't enjoy teaching, but because they cannot afford to do it and support their families. I don't really have a "back up" career choice. Teaching music is what I do and love. So I'm going to continue. I'll find my job for next year, hopefully, and stick with teaching for three years. By then I will be able to make an educated decision about whether I want to continue or whether I need to find a field that will enable me to raise my future children.

Thank you again for your support.

~Abby

[kamakajr]

I missed the deleted thread and I'm not sure I'm following everyone's positions in this one, either. But I'd like to share my thoughts about teachers with you.

I think teachers should get paid $100,000 a year or more for the work they do teaching our future generations to read, write, do arithmetic, pay attention in class, mind their manners, follow the rules, be kind etc., etc. The list goes on and on. You couldn't pay me enough money to do the kind of work they do day in and day out.

Teaching is not for everyone. Public school teachers in Hawaii are paid according to what has been budgeted by our legislature. And the average teacher salaries here are abysmal. So the problem needs to be corrected at the legislative level by budgeting more so we can retain and attract new teachers.

With that said, however, anyone who is unable to live within the established salary levels obviously needs to look for another occupation. That's the reality of it. Its going to take time and efforts of our communities and lawmakers to raise teacher salaries.

We all make tough decisions about the kind of livelihoods we would be happiest in. I personally know a CEO of a major company here in Hawaii who recently quit his high paying job and went back to teaching. It was his calling. Whoever says you can't get rich as a teacher needs to look up other definitions of rich in the dictionary.

[jrtmom3274]

Originally posted by StarTrekCaptain:
Well Ds9jullian you got yourself started on NCLB because I fully support it. We deal with that issue a lot in Prof. Dev. courses for teaching and I cannot say enough good things about it. I don't know about other states but here in Ohio I think it is good. I mean even if you don't think it's working, there's nothing wrong with having standards and having goals.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I teach in Ohio, and I can say that NCLB (aka No Child Left Untested) is NOT good. The idea behind it, excellent; the implimentation, hideous. There is no money to do what truly needs to happen to insure no child is left without a chance at a quality education.

There is nothing wrong with *having* standards. Allowing people who have never taught impose them is wrong. You will feel differently about NCLB and standards when much of your quality classroom time with your students is taken away by planning for those standards and a test for which you have no passing score, much the confusion and frustration of you and your students. You won't like having your professional development time eaten by power standards and indicators when you could be learning something useful for your classroom. When you are out of the classroom as student and in full-time, on your own, as a teacher, all the indoctrinization the Ohio Department of Education bestows on teacher candidates goes right out the window.

I've threatened to have a t-shirt made: "I'm a good teacher, and I oppose No Child Left Behind." NCLB-- fix it, fund it!!!

All that said... I don't want to sound negative about teaching. If it wasn't for the "power standards" and all that whoha (which I just wasted an in-service day on yesterday), I wouldn't have a complaint.

Am I rich? By no stretch of the imagination, but I am easily able to provide for my four dogs, cat and myself. I teach in one of the poorest districts in the state. I rent a small home in the country, have a nicer used van, support my AG habit well and participate actively in dog agility (not a cheap hobby) with my dogs. I budget carefully; that's key.

Whether or not you will be able to stay at home with your children if married to another teacher really depends. I know plenty of two-teacher couples, some who have one parent at home and some who both teach. They also budget carefully. The beauty of teaching is that you can stay home with your kids until they start school, and then, in most cases, your work schedule is the same as theirs. Honestly, there are many people who make less than teachers do, and they are able to support their families. And think about people who don't work at all... and have kids...

Anyway... no one enters the education profession to make the big bucks. The other rewards are plentiful, and as someone else said earlier, I cannot imagine doing anything else. There are frustrations, I am frequently sleep-deprived and I can't wait until summer, but I'm happy. There are "light bulb moments," when you see the light of recognition in the eyes of a chlid. You know you've reached them and taught them something. You'll be the teacher the teenage girl comes to to cry when her loser boyfriend lies to her and breaks her heart. You'll hear the words, "Miss Gates, I did it. Because of what you taught us last semester, I *know* I passed the writing questions on the OGT!" (Ohio Graduation Test)

Girls, it WILL be worth it. Despite the poop, it's the kids in the long run, even the ones who you think you'll pull your hair out over and the ones you can't help. They're worth it.

Please hang in there; the kids needs you and your future colleagues need you!
Heather
(Sophomore Language Arts and Yearbook)

[dianasmama]

Heather, can Diana come down and be your student one day? Please?

Laurie

[kamakajr]

Thank you for your post, Heather! Teachers like you make all the difference in the world.

[judiaci]

I am really so sorry! When I was replying to the post about the unmotivated student teachers who were unsure if teaching would pay enough to support a decent lifestyle, I accidently double posted. When I went to delete the double post, I accidently deleted the whole thread. I feel bad about this because people really took a lot of time to voice their opinions on this. Please feel free to start the thread again.

<font color="#051E50" size="1">[ March 24, 2005 12:34 PM: Message edited by: judiaci ]</font>

[dianasmama]

I just wanted to add here that I fully support you as a student teacher. I'm sorry that our society doesn't respect our teachers enough, as in pay scale, etc. I think it is a very noble position and since my daughter will be attending school this fall, it's nice to know that you are out there trying so hard to stay motivated. Keep your chin up, please, our kids DO need good teachers.

Diana's first preschool teacher last year, Mrs McKay, will always be remembered so fondly by all of us here, she set a very high mark for other teachers to meet up to.

With all that said, though, if you find that teaching is not really for you, then I hope you are able to take a new direction and find what truly makes you happy, and also allows you to earn a proper living. All the best and good luck to you!

Laurie

[Amy Pavlic]

I think in your thread you said you were student teaching at the high school level? If that is true it must be hard. I have to teen sons that have been taught to always be respectful to adults and their teachers in particular, sometimes what they tell me that other students in their classes in high school say to their teachers amazes me.

Our society does need good teachers, and I too think it is one of the most noble professions there is. I hope things get better for you.

Good Luck in whichever direction you go.

[amandajg]

Three cheers for all teachers (and a big [img]graemlins/thumbs_down.gif[/img] to NCLB).

If I could pick any profession in the whole world I would choose to be a teacher. However, I'm not going to be one (and made the decision not to be one back when I was still in high school) when I realised I could not make enough money to do all that I want to do in life (travel, mostly, and to write, etc). I've since found that my interests lie elsewhere so it was a good decision for me. But it's sad that it's such a difficult situation for so many who want to be teachers but don't think they could be.

My mom is a teacher and I admire teachers more than anyone else. I admire teachers on so many different levels: for your dedication to your profession, your dedication to your students, for doing what you love, and yes, for putting up with the nightmare that is NCLB. I don't want to get into a huge discussion about NCLB because I think others on here have covered it quite throughly, and because I can only share my opinions as the daughter of a teacher. I just know about NCLB from my long discussions with my mother about it. She's told me about the hours of paperwork, hours of testing children which takes up valuable learning and class time. One thing that NCLB doesn't take into account is how students home lives are. Students come to school sick, unfed, improperly clothed, with unstable home lives. How are they supposed to learn at the levels they are supposed to? A teacher can't feed, clothe, nurse, etc. classes of 20+ students, many of whom who are neglected by their parents. My mother, who was a long-term substitute for a 6th grade social studies class and was one of the best teachers in the grade during that time (she had so many parent compliments and some even said their kids weren't looking forward to the regular teacher coming back) can't actually teach 6th grade ss because she isn't "certified" in that area - she is only certified in K-5 or 6-8 science. Of course, they didn't have the same certification programs when she was back in college that they do now, so the new regulations essentially discriminate teachers who above a certain age, forcing them to either spend thousands of dollars to go back to school and get certified or to only teach in the narrow area that they were once certified in.

I won't go into details, but if I am ever elected to congress or senate or as president (hah) I promise all teachers that I will do everything in my power to change NCLB to make it more teacher-friendly. [img]wink.gif[/img] Oh - and it might be nice if the creators of NCLB actually consulted real teachers (not "educational experts" or a certain spouse that had once been a librarian, which is not exactly a teacher) from different parts of the country and from school districts representing a variety of demographics before drafting the legislation. [img]graemlins/thumbs_down.gif[/img]